locked Looking for True Time Sync Story #Timesync


William Smith
 

Not missing anything.  If It Ain't Broke, Don't Fix It.

If you are consistently within maybe 100 ms according to https://time.is then you are good.

Everyone has different hardware, different environment, different settings, if it works for you don't chase 'better'.

73, Willie N1JBJ


On Aug 5, 2021, at 8:41 AM, Michael Luke <mdluke1@...> wrote:

 

I didn’t want to ask a dumb question but my curiosity is getting the better of me. A year ago I upgraded from Windows 7 to Windows 10. I used Dem4 for time sync on 7 and though I had brought that forward on 10. After all the recent Email about time sync I thought I should abandon Dem4 and get a better time sync. To my surprise when I  researched my version of time sync I found out that I was NOT using any third party software and was getting sync from Windows 10 native software. This “seems” to have been working well for over a year. I do not want to add a third party software and take the chance of “breaking” anything when it seems to be working fine. My Delta Time in the window below seems to run and average +-0.1 to 0.3. What am I missing here?

 

Mike WA3MJZ

 

<image005.jpg>

 

 

<image006.jpg>





Michael (N1EN)
 

I will agree with the guidance that if it's working for you, there's no need to make changes, and I for one don't like to run more programs/services on my computer than I actually "need".

However, keep an eye on it.  As the battery backing up your computer's internal clock ages, it's possible that its accuracy will change.  Just because it's good enough today doesn't mean it will be good enough a couple of years from now.


Michael / N1EN


Gilbert Baron
 

Windows time control will now allow you to adjust more often. The default is very log and is fine for the needs of the vast majority. You can set Windows to do it more often and have sub second accuracy.

 

Outlook Laptop Gil W0MN

Hierro candente, batir de repente

44.08226N 92.51265W EN34rb

 

From: main@WSJTX.groups.io <main@WSJTX.groups.io> On Behalf Of William Smith
Sent: Thursday, August 5, 2021 07:53
To: main@WSJTX.groups.io
Subject: Re: [WSJTX] Looking for True Time Sync Story #Timesync

 

Not missing anything.  If It Ain't Broke, Don't Fix It.

 

If you are consistently within maybe 100 ms according to https://time.is then you are good.

 

Everyone has different hardware, different environment, different settings, if it works for you don't chase 'better'.

 

73, Willie N1JBJ

 



On Aug 5, 2021, at 8:41 AM, Michael Luke <mdluke1@...> wrote:

 

 

I didn’t want to ask a dumb question but my curiosity is getting the better of me. A year ago I upgraded from Windows 7 to Windows 10. I used Dem4 for time sync on 7 and though I had brought that forward on 10. After all the recent Email about time sync I thought I should abandon Dem4 and get a better time sync. To my surprise when I  researched my version of time sync I found out that I was NOT using any third party software and was getting sync from Windows 10 native software. This “seems” to have been working well for over a year. I do not want to add a third party software and take the chance of “breaking” anything when it seems to be working fine. My Delta Time in the window below seems to run and average +-0.1 to 0.3. What am I missing here?

 

Mike WA3MJZ

 

<image005.jpg>

 

 

<image006.jpg>



 


--

W0MN EN34rb 44.08226 N 92.51265 W

Hierro candente, batir de repente

HP Laptop


Karl Beckman WA8NVW - NNV5BH
 

For those other readers who may have overlooked previous comments from Dr Joe, FT4 requires the relative clock difference to not exceed one second, while FT8 is OK at just under 2.4 seconds.  If your QSO attempt to another station exceeds those DT maximums, then message decoding suddenly stops.  Note that both your spectrum analyzer and waterfall will continue to display the incoming signals. 
 
If Microsoft's time sync software can always meet those values on your computer as Gil's does (local time within one second), then 'it ain't broke, so don't fix it.'  Otherwise there are a few network time sync software apps that perform well.  Each has its vocal followers who point out specific features they find useful.  If you need still tighter clock accuracy for other reasons, such as a portable GPS-locked frequency reference or a common time server without availability of an internet connection, several designs have already been presented in this forum and elsewhere. 
 
--
Karl  WA8NVW  OH
WA8NVW@...
in WSJTX@groups.io


Ron Schunk
 

Every time, before I start up jtalert and wsjtx I check time.is ...normally it is NOT exact so I reboot the laptop...I have Meinberg on Windows 7 (I refuse to touch Windows 10) and my times are usually right on...
Ron
WA8KQF

Virus-free. www.avast.com


On Thu, Aug 5, 2021 at 2:28 PM Karl Beckman WA8NVW - AFA5VB <wa8nvw@...> wrote:

For those other readers who may have overlooked previous comments from Dr Joe, FT4 requires the relative clock difference to not exceed one second, while FT8 is OK at just under 2.4 seconds.  If your QSO attempt to another station exceeds those DT maximums, then message decoding suddenly stops.  Note that both your spectrum analyzer and waterfall will continue to display the incoming signals. 
 
If Microsoft's time sync software can always meet those values on your computer as Gil's does (local time within one second), then 'it ain't broke, so don't fix it.'  Otherwise there are a few network time sync software apps that perform well.  Each has its vocal followers who point out specific features they find useful.  If you need still tighter clock accuracy for other reasons, such as a portable GPS-locked frequency reference or a common time server without availability of an internet connection, several designs have already been presented in this forum and elsewhere. 
 
--
Karl  WA8NVW  OH
WA8NVW@...
in WSJTX@groups.io





Jim Brown
 

On 8/5/2021 11:28 AM, Karl Beckman WA8NVW - AFA5VB wrote:
Otherwise there are a few network time sync software apps that perform well.
If you're running Windows and have terrestrial (wired or your phone as a router) internet, all you need is this simple freeware app that I've been using since the earliest days of WSJT. http://www.timesynctool.com/

If you don't, you need a GPS puck and something like freeware bktTimeSync or GPSTime http://coaa.co.uk/gpstime.htm

73, Jim K9YC


Karl Beckman WA8NVW - NNV5BH
 

RON -
First, I would recommend you start up WSJTx and jtAlert BEFORE you check and reset the laptop's clock.  Those intensive disk I/Os are what messes up the computer's internal clock! 
 
Next, if your Meinberg installation included the NetworkTime Simple Network Time Protocol (SNTP) client for Windows, there is no need to shut down and reboot the laptop when its internal clock doesn't match the popular time.is website.  Just open NetworkTime by double-clicking its icon and click the left-most box labeled [UPDATE NOW] to start the automated correction process.  Meinberg also provides a "cheat sheet' of settings for the NetworkTime client if you are inclined to change the default settings. Again, if WSJT indicates that DT is less than 1 second for an FT4 QSO or less than 2.4 for an FT8 QSO, you don't need to adjust your clock.  NetworkTime will pull it into sync within a few minutes!
 
And last, if you do not have NetworkTime installed yet, K9YC Jim Brown helpfully provided a link to that website in the very next message (#27603) after your comment.  Tnx Jim!  http://www.timesynctool.com/
--
Karl  WA8NVW  OH
WA8NVW@...
in WSJTX@groups.io


Alan B
 

When configuring Meinberg if you include iburst on the server lines it will allow NTP to do a rapid time correction when it determines a need to. I use this on my laptop, and after waking up it watches the time servers for a minute or so to determine which server is working best and then it quickly synchronizes. No user interaction is required when configured properly. Distractions from things like disk activity cause no problems, it maintains time sync deltas under 10 milliseconds after a minute or so.

73 de w6akb

On Sat, Aug 7, 2021 at 8:57 AM Karl Beckman WA8NVW - AFA5VB <wa8nvw@...> wrote:
RON -
First, I would recommend you start up WSJTx and jtAlert BEFORE you check and reset the laptop's clock.  Those intensive disk I/Os are what messes up the computer's internal clock! 
 
Next, if your Meinberg installation included the NetworkTime Simple Network Time Protocol (SNTP) client for Windows, there is no need to shut down and reboot the laptop when its internal clock doesn't match the popular time.is website.  Just open NetworkTime by double-clicking its icon and click the left-most box labeled [UPDATE NOW] to start the automated correction process.  Meinberg also provides a "cheat sheet' of settings for the NetworkTime client if you are inclined to change the default settings. Again, if WSJT indicates that DT is less than 1 second for an FT4 QSO or less than 2.4 for an FT8 QSO, you don't need to adjust your clock.  NetworkTime will pull it into sync within a few minutes!
 
And last, if you do not have NetworkTime installed yet, K9YC Jim Brown helpfully provided a link to that website in the very next message (#27603) after your comment.  Tnx Jim!  http://www.timesynctool.com/
--
Karl  WA8NVW  OH
WA8NVW@...
in WSJTX@groups.io