locked Now that was very odd... #AudioIssues


JP Tucson, AZ
 

Version 2.3.1 - - - 

Everything was running fine; then nothing! It just quit processing the audio in, the waterfall stopped moving and no decoding took place.  CPU running at only 28%.  The only apparent life to wsjtx was the clock.  No error messages of any type! All other PC functions & programs continued to work as expected.

The radio audio was good, and so was the monitor audio from the SignaLink USB & it's pc monitor.  So audio was getting to the PC, just wasn't getting processed.  

So, I shut down wsjtx; let it sit for about 20 seconds and restarted it... still nothing - retried that 2 or 3 times.

Finally just rebooted the whole computer and everything went back to normal. 

Hopefully it won't do that again...

Just reporting it, in case this turns up into becoming an issue later on.

73 - John


Alan G4ZFQ
 

The radio audio was good, and so was the monitor audio from the SignaLink USB & it's pc monitor.  So audio was getting to the PC, just wasn't getting processed.
John,

This happened to me if the audio dropped out due to a USB disconnection, maybe partial.
If it happens again disconnect USB, reconnect, restart WSJT-X.

My particular problem was not permanently cured until I installed a PCIe USB card...

73 Alan G4ZFQ


JP Tucson, AZ
 

Thanks Alan,

I will try that, just to try it; however, I know the audio was getting to the PC as I could see & hear the PC's monitor getting the audio. It was the program that just would not take the audio, flow the wide graph, etc.

Thanks & 73  John

On Wed, Mar 31, 2021 at 7:47 AM Alan G4ZFQ <alan4alan@...> wrote:
> The radio audio was good, and so was the monitor audio from the
> SignaLink USB & it's pc monitor.  So audio was getting to the PC, just
> wasn't getting processed.

John,

This happened to me if the audio dropped out due to a USB disconnection,
maybe partial.
If it happens again disconnect USB, reconnect, restart WSJT-X.

My particular problem was not permanently cured until I installed a PCIe
USB card...

73 Alan G4ZFQ







--
73 - John - N7GHZ



Steve marsh (M0NMA)
 

I have experienced that too - everything was correct in the settings, but no audio in, and the waterfall had frozen, but the clock was still going. 


I think it may be linked with another problem I have where there is no modulation out from WSJT-X to the rig. Sometimes halting and restarting the TX fixes it, sometimes I need to restart the program. my suspicion is that Win 10 is messing up the audio ports as I once saw the audio out going to one of the other audio channels watching which was receiving audio in Sounds. This was despite all the audio settings being correct in wsjt-x settings and in the sounds properties for apps in win 10. 

--
Steve M0NMA


S_Blunt
 

I recently had the same problem after swapping to a new rig (IC-9700). After some time of just monitoring, the waterfall would freeze and nothing decoded but the clock still running.
Needed to close WSJT-X and restart but it would eventually happen again.
The reason was because my PC has 6 USB sockets on the back with 12 USB cables requiring connection, I use 2x 4-way USB hubs.
The cable to the rig was connected through one of these hubs (it isn't a problem with my other TRX's).
I swapped the connection to a direct socket on the back of the PC and since then I can run WSJT-X with no hang-ups.
Solution to the problem found by chance.


JP Tucson, AZ
 

Interesting that wsjtx & radios have a problem with USB hubs powering down, but mice & keyboards don't.



73 - John - N7GHZ


On Sat, Apr 3, 2021, 6:26 AM S_Blunt <s_blunt@...> wrote:
I recently had the same problem after swapping to a new rig (IC-9700). After some time of just monitoring, the waterfall would freeze and nothing decoded but the clock still running.
Needed to close WSJT-X and restart but it would eventually happen again.
The reason was because my PC has 6 USB sockets on the back with 12 USB cables requiring connection, I use 2x 4-way USB hubs.
The cable to the rig was connected through one of these hubs (it isn't a problem with my other TRX's).
I swapped the connection to a direct socket on the back of the PC and since then I can run WSJT-X with no hang-ups.
Solution to the problem found by chance.



Bill Somerville
 

John,

mice, keyboards, USB-serial adapters, etc. all use a point to point protocol based on interrupts over the USB, audio uses a different streaming protocol and is available to multiple consumers. Windows does not consider an audio stream that happens to be being consumed by a process as a use of the device and it will power it down regardless.

So in summary, the unwanted power saving is only a problem for audio streams, but it is easily worked around by disabling the appropriate power options, except for certain HDMI graphics cards that may have no way of disabling the power down behaviour of associated USB devices.

73
Bill
G4WJS.

On 03/04/2021 16:37, JP Tucson, AZ wrote:
Interesting that wsjtx & radios have a problem with USB hubs powering down, but mice & keyboards don't.



73 - John - N7GHZ

On Sat, Apr 3, 2021, 6:26 AM S_Blunt <s_blunt@...> wrote:
I recently had the same problem after swapping to a new rig (IC-9700). After some time of just monitoring, the waterfall would freeze and nothing decoded but the clock still running.
Needed to close WSJT-X and restart but it would eventually happen again.
The reason was because my PC has 6 USB sockets on the back with 12 USB cables requiring connection, I use 2x 4-way USB hubs.
The cable to the rig was connected through one of these hubs (it isn't a problem with my other TRX's).
I swapped the connection to a direct socket on the back of the PC and since then I can run WSJT-X with no hang-ups.
Solution to the problem found by chance.



neil_zampella
 

Mice and keyboards are treated differently as they are input devices.     

Neil, KN3ILZ

On 4/3/2021 10:37 AM, JP Tucson, AZ wrote:
Interesting that wsjtx & radios have a problem with USB hubs powering down, but mice & keyboards don't.



73 - John - N7GHZ

On Sat, Apr 3, 2021, 6:26 AM S_Blunt <s_blunt@...> wrote:
I recently had the same problem after swapping to a new rig (IC-9700). After some time of just monitoring, the waterfall would freeze and nothing decoded but the clock still running.
Needed to close WSJT-X and restart but it would eventually happen again.
The reason was because my PC has 6 USB sockets on the back with 12 USB cables requiring connection, I use 2x 4-way USB hubs.
The cable to the rig was connected through one of these hubs (it isn't a problem with my other TRX's).
I swapped the connection to a direct socket on the back of the PC and since then I can run WSJT-X with no hang-ups.
Solution to the problem found by chance.






 

Audio over USB is provided with a guaranteed payload per each 125 us frame. I can’t remember the term as my knowledge of USB has faded in the 10 years or so since I was working with it. However I don’t think latency is guaranteed especially if you are using bus-powered hubs (which most of the 4-port hubs are). But latency issues would show as delta-T values. I have an IC-7300, and the internal hub (driving the audio and CAT ports) is self-powered from the unswitched DC input to the rig: I assume the 9700 is similar.

 

I tend to connect critical devices to the motherboard hubs and have a 7-port self-powered hub for all the other stuff.

 

73 Phil GM3ZZA

 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 

From: Bill Somerville
Sent: 03 April 2021 16:49
To: main@WSJTX.groups.io
Subject: Re: [WSJTX] Now that was very odd... #AudioIssues

 

John,

 

mice, keyboards, USB-serial adapters, etc. all use a point to point protocol based on interrupts over the USB, audio uses a different streaming protocol and is available to multiple consumers. Windows does not consider an audio stream that happens to be being consumed by a process as a use of the device and it will power it down regardless.

 

So in summary, the unwanted power saving is only a problem for audio streams, but it is easily worked around by disabling the appropriate power options, except for certain HDMI graphics cards that may have no way of disabling the power down behaviour of associated USB devices.

 

73
Bill
G4WJS.

 

On 03/04/2021 16:37, JP Tucson, AZ wrote:

Interesting that wsjtx & radios have a problem with USB hubs powering down, but mice & keyboards don't.

 

 

73 - John - N7GHZ

 

On Sat, Apr 3, 2021, 6:26 AM S_Blunt <s_blunt@...> wrote:

I recently had the same problem after swapping to a new rig (IC-9700). After some time of just monitoring, the waterfall would freeze and nothing decoded but the clock still running.
Needed to close WSJT-X and restart but it would eventually happen again.
The reason was because my PC has 6 USB sockets on the back with 12 USB cables requiring connection, I use 2x 4-way USB hubs.
The cable to the rig was connected through one of these hubs (it isn't a problem with my other TRX's).
I swapped the connection to a direct socket on the back of the PC and since then I can run WSJT-X with no hang-ups.
Solution to the problem found by chance.

 

 


--
73 Phil GM3ZZA


JP Tucson, AZ
 

So... could you not 'fake it' by emulating the same interrupts occasionally to fool the system into not powering down?

73 - John - N7GHZ

On Sat, Apr 3, 2021, 8:49 AM Bill Somerville <g4wjs@...> wrote:
John,

mice, keyboards, USB-serial adapters, etc. all use a point to point protocol based on interrupts over the USB, audio uses a different streaming protocol and is available to multiple consumers. Windows does not consider an audio stream that happens to be being consumed by a process as a use of the device and it will power it down regardless.

So in summary, the unwanted power saving is only a problem for audio streams, but it is easily worked around by disabling the appropriate power options, except for certain HDMI graphics cards that may have no way of disabling the power down behaviour of associated USB devices.

73
Bill
G4WJS.

On 03/04/2021 16:37, JP Tucson, AZ wrote:
Interesting that wsjtx & radios have a problem with USB hubs powering down, but mice & keyboards don't.



73 - John - N7GHZ

On Sat, Apr 3, 2021, 6:26 AM S_Blunt <s_blunt@...> wrote:
I recently had the same problem after swapping to a new rig (IC-9700). After some time of just monitoring, the waterfall would freeze and nothing decoded but the clock still running.
Needed to close WSJT-X and restart but it would eventually happen again.
The reason was because my PC has 6 USB sockets on the back with 12 USB cables requiring connection, I use 2x 4-way USB hubs.
The cable to the rig was connected through one of these hubs (it isn't a problem with my other TRX's).
I swapped the connection to a direct socket on the back of the PC and since then I can run WSJT-X with no hang-ups.
Solution to the problem found by chance.






todkapuz2
 

I'm not sure the search is giving me all the answers and threads. 

A few months back I decided to update WSJT-X after a year on an earlier version... and whatever version that was I upgraded to (i honestly don't remember now) had this issue (it was always less than a day, but random), so I went to the release candidate ... and the problem went away... also in that week I looked at messages and saw things about USB power so I verified no power saving mode on any USB device (the computer already was set that way given its function)...    ultimately the RC makes you upgrade again (why??? I mean I know...) but anyohw.. 2.4.0 installed and was fine for awhile... but noticed over the last several weeks that its creeping back in, and in the last few days its getting nearly daily again. 

I've verified every USB related thing I can find is not able to be shut down for power saving, and  I only have 2 usb cables connected  (one for radio-audio/controll IC7300,   one for MORTTY hardware keying of RTTY), so no hubs or anything else in my connection chain. (I run my win10 box headless... with remote connection in so dont even have monitor or keyboard). 

The issue is like its a driver hang or something..... the waterfall stops... the receive level is what ever the last sample was, etc.  The program doesnt seem locked up otherwise..   no power issues with computer or radio (both are fully UPS with long rrun times).  

It is very random... somedays minutes... somedays hours and hours.   I just like it sitting there listening to give me heads up if South Dakota or AK eventually make it through on 10M...  

saw in one thread someone transmitted and it came back, so I will try that, but still doesnt really solve what ever the root issue is. I worry its windows 10 related... and the forced restarts every week due to updates. 


William Smith
 

Connecting and/or disconnecting with RDP will also cause audio to fail and the program will need to be restarted.

73, Willie N1JBJ


On Jul 29, 2021, at 3:39 PM, todkapuz2 <whuckaba@...> wrote:

I'm not sure the search is giving me all the answers and threads.

A few months back I decided to update WSJT-X after a year on an earlier version... and whatever version that was I upgraded to (i honestly don't remember now) had this issue (it was always less than a day, but random), so I went to the release candidate ... and the problem went away... also in that week I looked at messages and saw things about USB power so I verified no power saving mode on any USB device (the computer already was set that way given its function)... ultimately the RC makes you upgrade again (why??? I mean I know...) but anyohw.. 2.4.0 installed and was fine for awhile... but noticed over the last several weeks that its creeping back in, and in the last few days its getting nearly daily again.

I've verified every USB related thing I can find is not able to be shut down for power saving, and I only have 2 usb cables connected (one for radio-audio/controll IC7300, one for MORTTY hardware keying of RTTY), so no hubs or anything else in my connection chain. (I run my win10 box headless... with remote connection in so dont even have monitor or keyboard).

The issue is like its a driver hang or something..... the waterfall stops... the receive level is what ever the last sample was, etc. The program doesnt seem locked up otherwise.. no power issues with computer or radio (both are fully UPS with long rrun times).

It is very random... somedays minutes... somedays hours and hours. I just like it sitting there listening to give me heads up if South Dakota or AK eventually make it through on 10M...

saw in one thread someone transmitted and it came back, so I will try that, but still doesnt really solve what ever the root issue is. I worry its windows 10 related... and the forced restarts every week due to updates.